tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-24917443.post116394740252651259..comments2023-05-07T02:34:30.801-07:00Comments on One Quaker Take: what's in a name?Tmothy Travishttp://www.blogger.com/profile/02788311873771605510noreply@blogger.comBlogger2125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-24917443.post-1164115839538278012006-11-21T05:30:00.000-08:002006-11-21T05:30:00.000-08:00Dear Timothy, this was another wonderful post! I ...Dear Timothy, this was another wonderful post! I appreciated your Veteran's Day posting too, was deeply moved by it, but not led to comment on it at the time. Here I feel led to comment, a little.<BR/><BR/>Neither of the two points I am going to offer by way of comment is a disagreement with what I hear you saying; both are amplifications, offered in hopes they might be useful.<BR/><BR/>First point. You write, <I>"In legislative work it is often said that 'the devil is in the details,' meaning that broad agreements are often difficult things from which to work toward specific applications because people who can agree on ends will conflict over means. <BR/><BR/>"I am fond of pointing out that it is God that is actually in those details, for when unity is found it is not the product of the Enemy but, rather, of the work of the Word in people's lives...."</I><BR/><BR/>And I quite agree. <I>Both</I> God and the devil are in the details, warring over how we will act as we work toward broad goals that can prove either good fruit or bad --<BR/><BR/>William Blake once wrote, famously:<BR/><I>"He who would do good to another must do it in Minute Particulars:<BR/>General Good is the plea of the scoundrel, hypocrite & flatterer...<BR/>Establishment of Truth depends on destruction of Falsehood continually,<BR/>On Circumcision, not on Virginity, O Reasoners of Albion!"</I><BR/><BR/>Thus, as individuals, we struggle for our own faithfulness to the guidance of the Spirit, and ultimately our own salvation, one Minute Particular at a time. Or so I think Blake was saying, and so I myself believe.<BR/><BR/>I hear you reminding us that, as a group, we are called to go further, and -- as you say -- <I>unite</I> in what we do. A good reminder! I merely hope that we can remember that true unity is something done one Minute Particular at a time, and that the doing of it depends on that Circumcision that Blake referred to, that Circumcision which (as George Fox reminded Margaret Fell in the speech by which she was reached and convinced) is an Inward, not Outward Circumcision.<BR/><BR/>Second point. You write, <I>"...All of us in the Society--from the most EFI to the most Beanite and beyond--can look through the literature of the founding generation and find justification for our points of view. That is, I think, how it is that Friends could separate and divide while believing that they were the real Quakers, here, and that those from whom they separated--or were separated--were not. <BR/><BR/>"So, even though all through all the divisions and the separations Friends could find 'themselves' in the doctrinal watershed of the original Quaker Movement they also stand convicted of ignoring that those with whom they (and we) disagree can also find themselves in that same watershed."</I><BR/><BR/>There is a problem here, I think, in <I>the way we choose to listen</I> to the founding two generations (the first being that of Fox and the Valiant Sixty, and the second, that of Barclay and Penn). And that problem is that we read them looking for confirmation of our own views, rather than trying to understand what they themselves were trying to communicate. EFI Friends, looking for confirmation of their own views, turn the early Friends into people like Billy Graham, while liberal unprogrammed Friends, looking for confirmation of theirs, turn them into people like Martin Luther King, Jr.<BR/><BR/>I would say: We cannot succeed in being Friends unless we first learn how to be true listeners -- true listeners to what early Friends were actually saying, and, again, true listeners in that same manner to what God is actually saying (which, again, is not just confirmation of our own views), and, again, true listeners in the same manner to one another. One Minute Particular at a time!<BR/><BR/>I think that my efforts to learn how to practice that sort of true listening have helped me, personally, to come a little nearer that spirit of meekness and humility that you are talking about. I hope I am not deceiving myself in this!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-24917443.post-1164085490835358702006-11-20T21:04:00.002-08:002006-11-20T21:04:00.002-08:00Thanks for this post! I really appreciate your ta...Thanks for this post! I really appreciate your take on this issue--we can't think about what unites us until we understand what divides us, and out of that we can work toward unity and reconciliation again. I agree that it is so often an "unruly spirit" in us that causes division. The hard part is that not everyone recognizes this as an unruly spirit, and some see it as the Spirit instead. So how do we know, as a Society, when we're following the Spirit? We might think we know, but how can we be sure we're not being enticed by an unruly spirit instead? I think your answer to that is excellent as well--does the s/Spirit we're following lead us to humility and meekness, to listening and waiting and openness to God's leading? If not, we're probably following a divisive spirit. If so, let us wait and hear what the Spirit has to say to us as a body.<BR/><BR/>If only we could do this all together, as Friends, and give it the time and trust to truly hear what the Spirit is calling us to together! It seems hypocritical that we talk about peace and yet have so much division in our tiny denomination. I think God desires us to be in unity, and I hope and pray that this unity may happen in our generation.<BR/><BR/>Thanks to Friend Marshall for pointing out this post to me!<BR/><BR/>~ChericeAnonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07488876505679035140noreply@blogger.com